Saturn Wireless - LED Colours

Discussion in 'C-Bus Wired Hardware' started by SteveK, Jul 9, 2007.

  1. SteveK

    SteveK

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    I have saturn wireless, and was wondering if the Indicator LED's are able to be changed from Orange to Blue? (I know that wired can)

    I noticed that toolkit 1.6.1 has the global Programming option wizard to bulk change input Unit LED Colours, but it doesn't work on wireless saturns.

    I presume that the wireless Saturns don't support dual colour LEDS, but was hoping someone could clarify this for me.
     
    SteveK, Jul 9, 2007
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  2. SteveK

    Duncan

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    The LED's on Wireless Saturn units are definitely Orange only.
     
    Duncan, Jul 9, 2007
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  3. SteveK

    znelbok

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    That seems strange.

    I have not seen a wireless saturn in real life yet and cant comment on how similar they are to the wired, but if you have a mix of both and have set up the wired to use the blue LED's, you cant get a match between them.

    Was this an oversight, or a limitation in the design?

    Mick
     
    znelbok, Jul 10, 2007
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  4. SteveK

    Duncan

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    I can't provide a definitive answer but I believe that due to the limited power available to a wireless unit the current consumption of a blue LED was going to cause problems..
     
    Duncan, Jul 10, 2007
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  5. SteveK

    ashleigh Moderator

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    Yep - blue LEDs need a few more volts than were available at the time.

    One day in future this is likely to be rectified because technology has marched on even in only the last 2 years. But its barely a twinkle in anybodys eye so don't get your hopes up too high - its a long long long way off.
     
    ashleigh, Jul 10, 2007
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  6. SteveK

    Phil.H

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    Conspiracy

    I wasn't going to say anything but I believe it is right for C-Bus community members to know the truth.
    The C-Bus wireless technology was developed in conjunction with the American NSA. These units are able to collect your conversations and thoughts and send them via low powered RF to the Echelon network. I have come to find out "from a source" that blue LED's emit a tiny amount of interference (much more than orange LED's) so the NSA banned using blue.
    Ashleigh is right blue LED's are a long long way off - but not for the reasons stated.

    Got to go - two black vans just pulled up out the front :eek:
     
    Phil.H, Jul 10, 2007
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  7. SteveK

    Ross

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    Ross, Jul 11, 2007
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  8. SteveK

    Darpa

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    Ahh yes, but notice that (and this is only in relation to that manufacturer's specs that you have quoted), the Orange LED uses 20mA @ 2.1 Volts, whereas the Blue uses 20mA @ 3.6 Volts, big difference there.

    The LEDS in Input units (I'm lead to believe) are SMD LEDs, not your normal 5mm ones.

    Also note the disclaimer at the bottom of their page:

     
    Darpa, Jul 11, 2007
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  9. SteveK

    ashleigh Moderator

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    Correct.

    The physics of blue LEDs means they generally need about 3 to 3.3 V across them before they turn on.

    Orange LEDs typically need 2 to 2.2 V.

    Cbus wireless internal electronics all runs at 3.1 V (for all sorts of ugly reasons) which means that blue LEDs won't work - or if they do, it would be very hit and miss.

    And, by the way, there is no way on earth of getting 20 mA through a LED in a cbus wireless product. All Clipsal LEDs run at much lower currents, typically 1 mA. Most of our LEDs are specially batch selected for us by the manufacturers to ensure brightness uniformity - otherwise you get something really poxy with some LEDs bright and others dim, for the same current.

    LEDs for indicators look trivial, but once you scratch the surface you find there are many subtleties that take a lot of sorting out in order to make a mass-market product with consistent brightness and colour, year in year out.
     
    ashleigh, Jul 12, 2007
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  10. SteveK

    NickD Moderator

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    And before anyone jumps in with "but the wireless remote has blue LEDs!?!"...

    The remote is a different beast..

    1) it incorporates a switchmode LED driver to boost the voltage to something sufficient to drive blue LEDs

    2) it runs off batteries, and because it doesn't have to receive messages, it can go to sleep to conserve battery power, which makes 1) viable.

    Nick
     
    NickD, Jul 12, 2007
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  11. SteveK

    Phil.H

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    Hey Guys :eek::eek::eek:

    I mentioned that I knew why the orange LEDs were used instead of the Blue then I mention that a couple of black vans pulled up out the front and none of you showed any concern. I then disappear for over two years again no concern shown :confused:

    Anyway I AM BACK - So what has been going on ???
     
    Phil.H, Dec 28, 2009
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  12. SteveK

    ashleigh Moderator

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    Nothing to see phil. Time for a snooze :)
     
    ashleigh, Dec 28, 2009
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  13. SteveK

    Darpa

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    Firstly, welcome home Phil :)

    Secondly, after what I know of you, I presumed that the black vans were there under your direction, to take you to your secret underground bunker. ;)
     
    Darpa, Dec 28, 2009
    #13
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