Suggested alarm??

Hi Gents, (not to be sexist, but - are there any ladies here??)

I'm all set to start construction of a new house soon and have been charged with finding a suitable alarm to be installed. My partner is not the least bit keen on any sort of home automation yet - but that's only down to his experience with friends and family who endlessly tinker and never get things working properly. You'd think he'd realise I'm not an endless tinkerer, but .. I digress.

I'm after an alarm that I can easily hook into at a later date with a few Cbus units - for the purpose of detecting current status (armed / home) and/or firing of PIRs around the house. To take advantage of it I may even stick a few extra PIRs or other such things outside the toilet door, hallway, pantry, etc.

It doesn't have to be some super expensive unit - just enough to dial my mobile, perhaps be activated/deactivated via a remote, and allow a relay or something to be hooked in.

Any suggestions?

Cheers,
Matt

 

Try The Ness D16X Cbus Enabled panel it has a couple a AUx outputs and option for three card readers to be added plus will also haddle rf remotes and has a built in Cbus interface. Or try the Ness M1 Elk panel it is much more expanable then the D16X and has voice prompt user menus to ring in and out.
ness.com.au

 

For what you have described the Ness panel or the Clipsal badged equiv (as Nathan has pointed out) would be a good match.. The systems are powerful enough for what you want and importantly they are bullet proof...

 

I always ask for the Challenger Alarm panel without exception. It can do things that other panels can only dream about.

 

Hey Tobex,

You are right, the Challenger is world class. I have been specifying it for Government and corporate clients for about a decade. Several years ago the Titan and Ares programming and management software had no competition that even came close to it. In the last couple of years other players have caught up in the software arena. The only down side is when Dean R sold the company. I think it was sold to SSL ?? then ended up in the hands of GE Security - Big multi national who is bound to use it for their own interests primarily. I know DAS still distribute to the market but I am not sure what new developments we will see

Back to the original question, I think the challenger would be too expensive, too powerful and too complex for Matt's basic requirements

 

The only reason I go for it is because it has 5000V of isolation and a private data LAN for remote zones. Saves me time when cabling for several levels with one node per floor.

I have seen many alarm panels fail the 18V test across the siren or keypad. Just two pocket sized 9V batteries and the whole thing goes down.

When you say price .... are we talking about a $700,000 house with $150,000 worth of contents ? Similarly I often see people spend $200,000 on a car and then ummmm and aaahhhh over something costing $900.

In proportion to what is at stake and the safeguards I dont always agree with the lowest cost security solution. A bit like having a rocket with reverse pedal brakes.

 

Every alarm panel is C-Bus enabled. All you do is expand with relay modules and fit a C-Bus coupler. Hardly worth the trouble of being limited to one design. Below is a photo of a Challenger with C-bus.

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Tobex,

I hope you had a chat to your apprentice who wired up the bus coupler

The other down side about using a commercial secuirty system in a domestic situation is the human interface. The keypads for the Challenger or the Concept 4000 are not user friendly in the instant recognition stakes. ie looking at a keypad and having instant information as to what is going on - zones faulted / alarm, AC power etc. The higher end systems require user input eg menu-enter, PIN-enter, 2-enter = unsealed inputs, very difficult when a keypad is beeping at 2am and the home owner is trying to find out which zone has triggered the entry timer.

LED status only really works for systems up to 16 zones maybe 24 at a stretch. If your zone input count is higher than that then you have less choice.

For the record I have a Challenger in my home because of zone count and testing programs etc.

PS Don't go too hard on the apprentice...

 

Agreed.

However have you seen the new Concept Touch Screen? http://www.innerrange.com/ProductsPages/Concept/Touchscreen.htm

It's a marked improvement.

Cheers

Rohan

 

Rohan,

The Inner Range guys are making some really good progress these days - shame about Tecom falling into the hands of a mega multi national. The keypad issue I was referring to was something like this. Middle of the night security armed in partial mode, entry timer tripped - keypad beeping, the ability to glance at a keypad and instantly determine which zone has been tripped. I have also had clients in large homes who have stated they look at a keypad to determine which room the kids are in.
Quick tip - if putting in a security system (LED keypads) I always put one in the master bedroom and within view of occupants lying in bed. Small point but very important.

 

For Tecom to enter into US military bases it needed to be associated with a company that clearances for installation.

 

The photo is deceptive but not misleading. It is wired correctly.

Why do you need to see the LED zones ? You can just go through the house and see which light is on !

If you have an interactive configuration I would then assume that whatever the problem was it would illuminate that zone of the house. The last thing people need in an alarm condition is darkness.

 

Hmm, I suppose that sounds good in theory.

LED keypads are good for seeing what is going on when the system is not even armed.

Alarms in daylight hours usually don't require lights to be turned on.

This (however) is a very good point. In my place I have the power of "macro logic" in the Challenger and on the C-Bus side I have the "mega power" of the PAC module {Vote 1 Snods for Prime Minister}. With all this processing power either side you only need "point reference" between the two systems to end up with powerful "functional integration". I stuck an 8 way relay card in the Challenger DGP and cannot think of what to do with relays 5-8. I have all I want in terms of integration from relays 1-4.

I have also used the Clipsal Homesafe (16 zone C-Bus Enabled) configured the panel to full capacity including access and tied to a large C-Bus install, the security system and integration to C-Bus is rock solid.

I suppose it is horses for courses

 

That must be why several EU countries by law require headlights on all the time. As far as LCD panels go ... not useful in a panic situation. Illumination in the daylight is even more telltale than at night.

Why not just flick to channel 4 and see which zones of the house are red. If I wanted to poke around with tiny little screens I would do the whole thing on a mobile PDA. AMX and Crestron both do a zone display and I personally prefer proximity cards for entry.

When people are under stress they dont use all these really clever displays anyhow.

 

Trialing the touchscreen at the moment. It is still in beta and u require the latest firmware version 5.80.

I also use the Concept 4000 with high level CBUS Interface.

Why use extra hardware when it can all be accomplished with a Uart PCB, RS232 lead and PCI.

The Concept is a powerful system that can integrate Security, Access Control, CCTV and Automation.

 

The only reason I dont rave about Concept alarms would be that when it comes to a large installation the wiring becomes messy and expensive compared to running a central processor and several remote panels with the Challenger all acting as one system via a special network technology.

 

Is it just me or does any touch screen do what you want it to do and the brand makes no difference.

 

Both the Tecom & Concept expand the same way, Expanders, 4 door controllers etc... They even use the same LAN cable.

I use both Tecom and Concept, with the concept far more flexible and expandable. Multiple sites can be managed with Insight.

With tecom's V9 multiple panel connections never being truly successful, they have now released forcefield to try and keep up.

 

Didnt Tecom always have a higher version for multi-site monitoring.