Toggle timer issue with blind control

Sorry, yet another thread on this topic. I've searched, but haven't found the solution to this specific problem.

I'm controlling blinds from a touch screen, using UP and DOWN buttons programmed as toggle timers. Problem scenario is this:

The blind is travelling down, and they change their mind and want it to go up. Rather than press DOWN to stop the blind first, they will press UP while it is still moving down. The blind stops. At this point, pressing DOWN will send the blind up, and pressing UP will send the blinds down.





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I understand why this is happening, but I'm wasting my time explaining that to the user. I figure that if my UP and DOWN buttons were capable of cancelling each other's timers, this wouldn't happen. But even if I could do that, it would mean an instantaneous change in direction, which isn't good for the motors. All this points to logic control.


My second thought is to add a STOP button to the screen, which would open both UP & DOWN channels. But I assume this would leave any timers still running... if so I would need it to toggle them off too.


So, any solutions to this problem using the existing functionality of the touch screen?

 

Use the scene manager in the Ctouch.

Create 2 x GA's - "Blind UP" & "Blind DOWN" in the "Lighting" application, these two GA's will reside in the output unit physically connected to the blinds.

Create 3 x GA's - Blind UP Trigger, Blind DOWN Trigger & Blind STOP Trigger in the "Lighting" application.

Create 3 scenes - UP, DOWN & STOP.

Setup the appropriate trigger GA to match the scene function at 100%.

Within each scene set opposite (output unit) GA to 0% on the first line, set the other blind triggers to 0% and then set the expected (output unit) GA function (i.e. Blind UP) to 100% on the last line.

I.e. If you created the Blind UP scene you would set the "Blind DOWN" GA (output unit) to 0% over 0 seconds at 0 ramp rate on the first line, then set the "Blind DOWN Trigger" & the "Blind STOP Trigger" to 0% over 0 seconds at 0 ramp rate on the subsequent lines. On the last line you would pulse the "Blind UP" GA (output unit) to 100% over 30 seconds (or however long it takes for the blind to travel) at 0 ramp rate.

For the Blind STOP Scene just set "Blind UP", "Blind DOWN", Blind UP Trigger" & "Blind DOWN Trigger" to 0% over 0 seconds at 0 ramp rate.

Now create your UP, DOWN & STOP buttons on the Ctouch page.

Use the appropriate blind triggers for each button.

Set each of these buttons up as resetable "TIMERS" (not toggle), Ramp Rate - instantaneously, Duration - 30 seconds (or however long it takes for the blind to travel) & the set the Final Level to - Return to level 0.

Set the STOP timer button to about 2 seconds.

You should now see that the UP, DOWN & STOP buttons turn each other off so it correctly follows the state of the blind & that the buttons turn off when the blind is fully open or closed.

I hope this helps.

 

Thanks Peter, looks perfect! Now, I just need to apply it to 48 blinds...

I do have one question. Why do the UP/DOWN/STOP buttons need to be timers, when the timing is taken care of within each scene? My usual method for triggering scenes, is to set it to activate at Trigger GA Level 100%, then use a bell press or 1 second timer to trigger it. Any reason why that wouldn't work in this case?

Cheers.

 

The reason why you setup the buttons as timers is because it's "nice" & "pretty" & "fluffy" when the LED on the switch follows the action of the blind. i.e. if the blind takes 42 seconds to go up the LED will turn off after 42 seconds.

The scene will not turn the ON LED off, it only turns ther other (not used) LED's off.

Try it, you will see want I mean.

You might be able to charge extra for all the fluffiness you have now included...

 

Ah, I am definitely a fan of the fluffy touches in an installation. In this case, the only control is via the C-touch, so there are no LEDs to see. I'll definitely keep that tip in mind for future installs though.

I'll be road testing this new scene setup on Wednesday evening, so I'll report back on how I go.

Cheers!

 

OK then, setup the Ctouch buttons with the active background colour set. This will give you all the fluffiness you coul ever want.

Don't forget to set the up button as an UP triangle & the DOWN button as a down triangle as well as the STOP button as a square - if it was any fluffier people would question your sexuality...

 

I tried your setup suggestion Peter, and the stop function didn't work as intended. That doesn't necessarily mean your advice was bad, it could well have been a PEBCAK issue. I didn't tinker long enough to really nut it out though, because in a flash of light I found a simpler solution. So simple that I feel rather silly for running back home in tears to start a thread without thinking about it at the time.

All I did was add a stop button to the existing arrangement. So the button layout for each blind is:

UP - toggle timer
STOP - scene containing off commands for up & down channels
DOWN - toggle timer

I didn't try this at first, because I thought using a stop button to switch channels off would leave timers running, and cause weirdness. When you assume...

Users are instructed to use the STOP button before changing directions. It's an economical setup, and not idiot proof. If a user presses UP while the blind is going down, they will still have the problem I raised in the first post - but this time, they have a STOP button to reset everything. "If in doubt, press stop."

Thanks for the advice though Peter, it did lead me to my solution. It's definitely an idiot proof setup you've suggested, but I took the easy way out this time.

 

Ctouch and blind control

Hi, I have been through the same process trying to find the best means of controlling blinds through the Ctouch. My answer was similar but with the buttons on the touch screen I duplicated the page several times and then did the following (the customer did not want a stop button for a page containing auto - timed control), when you press the down arrow as well as starting the down timer it page flips to another identical page where the up button becomes stop (but not visualy to the user) so if they hit the up button the blinds will stop and then, this causes another page flip where you are back with either up or down to select from and vice versa for the up operation. This worked well for about a month and then we had a shuddering effect occur. After 4 hours of testing and thinking I came to the conclusion that the problem was debounce time, because a press for a smidge too long or short would initiate a bell press type result, not desired for auto run. I spoke to tech support, no you cant alter the parameters for the buttons (debounce time) it seems. The client is high profile and not happy. There is some big do do going down after we installed the gear on a CIS reps promise that CBus can "do anything". Good luck, let me know if you have any ideas, Ian

 

My 5 cents

Have you had a look at this tread?

http://www.cbusforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97&page=3

Especially Post 29 to 30
Alternatively my post (32) as well